#482 – Pavel Durov: Telegram, Freedom, Censorship, Money, Power & Human Nature

Pavel Durov is the founder and CEO of Telegram. Thank you for listening ❤ Check out our sponsors: https://lexfridman.com/sponsors/ep482-sc See below for timestamps, transcript, and to give feedback, submit questions, contact Lex, etc. Transcript: https://lexfridman.com/pavel-durov-transcript CONTACT LEX: Feedback - give feedback to Lex: https://lexfridman.com/survey AMA - submit questions, videos or call-in: https://lexfridman.com/ama Hiring - join our team: https://lexfridman.com/hiring Other - other ways to get in touch: https://lexfridman.com/contact EPISODE LINKS: Pavel's Telegram: https://t.me/durov Pavel's X: https://x.com/durov Telegram: https://telegram.org/ Telegram Contests: https://contest.com/ SPONSORS: To support this podcast, check out our sponsors & get discounts: Miro: Online collaborative whiteboard platform. Go to https://miro.com/ UPLIFT Desk: Standing desks and office ergonomics. Go to https://upliftdesk.com/lex Fin: AI agent for customer service. Go to https://fin.ai/lex LMNT: Zero-sugar electrolyte drink mix. Go to https://drinkLMNT.com/lex Shopify: Sell stuff online. Go to https://shopify.com/lex OUTLINE: (00:00) - Introduction (02:46) - Sponsors, Comments, and Reflections (11:29) - Philosophy of freedom (14:37) - No alcohol (22:42) - No phone (28:38) - Discipline (49:50) - Telegram: Lean philosophy, privacy, and geopolitics (1:05:12) - Arrest in France (1:21:23) - Romanian elections (1:32:18) - Power and corruption (1:41:50) - Intense education (1:53:51) - Nikolai Durov (1:58:19) - Programming and video games (2:02:33) - VK origins & engineering (2:19:46) - Hiring a great team (2:29:02) - Telegram engineering & design (2:48:04) - Encryption (2:53:01) - Open source (2:57:48) - Edward Snowden (3:00:20) - Intelligence agencies (3:01:32) - Iran and Russia government pressure (3:04:41) - Apple (3:11:38) - Poisoning (3:43:53) - Money (3:52:45) - TON (4:02:35) - Bitcoin (4:05:34) - Two chairs dilemma (4:12:14) - Children (4:23:24) - Father (4:27:55) - Quantum immortality (4:34:27) - Kafka PODCAST LINKS: - Podcast Website: https://lexfridman.com/podcast - Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/2lwqZIr - Spotify: https://spoti.fi/2nEwCF8 - RSS: https://lexfridman.com/feed/podcast/ - Podcast Playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLrAXtmErZgOdP_8GztsuKi9nrraNbKKp4 - Clips Channel: https://www.youtube.com/lexclips