Tim Ferriss: Bestselling Author, Human Guinea Pig

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#649: Rick Rubin, Legendary Producer — Timeless Methods for Unlocking Creativity, Secrets Hidden in Plain Sight, The Future with AI, Helpful Distractions, Working with Strong Personalities, Breaking Out of “The Sameness,” and More

The Tim Ferriss Show

Tim Ferriss is a self-experimenter and bestselling author, best known for The 4-Hour Workweek, which has been translated into 40+ languages. Newsweek calls him "the world's best human guinea pig," and The New York Times calls him "a cross between Jack Welch and a Buddhist monk." In this show, he deconstructs world-class performers from eclectic areas (investing, chess, pro sports, etc.), digging deep to find the tools, tactics, and tricks that listeners can use.

Brought to you by <a href="http://wealthfront.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Wealthfront</a> high-yield savings account, <a href="https://www.onepeloton.com/row" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Peloton Row</a> premium rower for an efficient workout, and <a href="https://www.youneedabudget.com/landing/tim-ferriss/?utm_medium=referral_sponsored&utm_source=timferriss&utm_content=tim-ferriss-fall21" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">You Need A Budget</a> cult-favorite money management app.Rick Rubin (<a href="https://twitter.com/RickRubin" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">@RickRubin</a>) is a nine-time GRAMMY-winning producer, one of Time magazine’s 100 most influential people in the world, and the most successful producer in any genre, according to Rolling Stone. He has collaborated with artists from Tom Petty to Adele, Johnny Cash to the Red Hot Chili Peppers, Beastie Boys to Slayer, Kanye West to the Strokes, and System of a Down to Jay-Z. You can find my 2015 interview with Rick at <a href="http://tim.blog/RickRubin" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tim.blog/RickRubin</a>.His new book is <a href="https://www.amazon.com/Creative-Act-Way-Being/dp/B0B3L8W1JJ/?tag=offsitoftimfe-20" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">THE CREATIVE ACT: A Way of Being</a>. *This episode is brought to you by <a href="http://wealthfront.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Wealthfront</a>! Wealthfront is an app that helps you save and invest your money. Right now, you can earn 3.8% APY—that’s the Annual Percentage Yield—with the <a href="http://wealthfront.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Wealthfront Cash Account</a>. That’s more than fifteen times more interest than if you left your money in a savings account at the average bank, according to FDIC.gov. It takes just a few minutes to sign up, and then you’ll immediately start earning 3.8% interest on your savings. And when you open an account today, you’ll get <a href="http://wealthfront.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">an extra fifty-dollar bonus</a> with a deposit of five hundred dollars or more.  Visit <a href="http://wealthfront.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Wealthfront.com/Tim</a> to get started.*This episode is also brought to you by <a href="https://ynab.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">You Need A Budget</a>! <a href="https://ynab.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">You Need A Budget</a> is a cult-favorite budgeting app for a reason—it works. The app and its simple 4-rule method will change the way you think about money and get you laser focused to live the life you want. With <a href="https://ynab.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">You Need A Budget</a>, you’ll finally experience financial clarity, having all the data points you need to make informed financial decisions. With all that information at your fingertips, you can finally home in on buying that dream house, paying off that last debt, or setting yourself up to retire early. And the <a href="https://ynab.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">You Need A Budget</a> team offers daily, free, live classes—including video courses, bootcamps, and challenges—as well as active fan groups in every corner of the internet. Try the app free for 34 days (no credit card required) at <a href="https://ynab.com/tim" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">YouNeedABudget.com/Tim</a>.*This episode is also brought to you by <a href="https://www.onepeloton.com/row" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Peloton Row</a>! <a href="https://www.onepeloton.com/row" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Peloton Row</a> brings personalized form features to rowing to help you learn and master your stroke. Form features like Form Assist indicate how to improve your stroke in class in real time, as well as a detailed post-class breakdown so you can hit the <a href="https://www.onepeloton.com/row" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Row</a> harder next time. And with features that allow you to personalize your target metrics, you become an expert at the level and pace that feels good for you. You get all your cardio and strength in one shot, while protecting your joints and ligaments in a high-intensity, low-impact way. Fun fact: you work 86% of your muscles in only 15 minutes.Right now is the perfect time to get rowing with Peloton Row. Peloton Row offers a variety of classes for all levels plus game-changing features that help you get rowing or advance the rowing you can already do. <a href="https://www.onepeloton.com/row" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Explore Peloton Row at OnePeloton.com/Row.</a>*For show notes and past guests on <a href="http://tim.blog/podcast" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">The Tim Ferriss Show</a>, please visit <a href="https://tim.blog/podcast/?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=podcast-description" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tim.blog/podcast</a>.For deals from sponsors of <a href="http://tim.blog/podcast" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">The Tim Ferriss Show</a>, please visit <a href="http://tim.blog/podcast-sponsors" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tim.blog/podcast-sponsors</a>Sign up for Tim’s email newsletter (5-Bullet Friday) at <a href="https://go.tim.blog/5-bullet-friday-1/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tim.blog/friday</a>.For transcripts of episodes, go to <a href="http://tim.blog/transcripts" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tim.blog/transcripts</a>.Discover Tim’s books: <a href="http://tim.blog/books" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">tim.blog/books</a>.Follow Tim:Twitter: <a href="https://twitter.com/tferriss" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">twitter.com/tferriss</a> Instagram: <a href="https://instagram.com/timferriss/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">instagram.com/timferriss</a>YouTube: <a href="https://www.youtube.com/timferriss" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">youtube.com/timferriss</a>Facebook: <a href="https://www.facebook.com/TimFerriss/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">facebook.com/timferriss</a> LinkedIn: <a href="http://linkedin.com/in/timferriss" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">linkedin.com/in/timferriss</a>Past guests on <a href="http://tim.blog/podcast" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">The Tim Ferriss Show</a> include <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/12/08/jerry-seinfeld/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Jerry Seinfeld</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/06/26/hugh-jackman/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Hugh Jackman</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/04/16/jane-goodall/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Jane Goodall</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2018/11/27/lebron-james-mike-mancias/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">LeBron James</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/05/20/kevin-hart/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Kevin Hart</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2018/09/07/doris-kearns-goodwin-leadership/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Doris Kearns Goodwin</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2015/12/06/jamie-foxx/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Jamie Foxx</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/10/19/matthew-mcconaughey/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Matthew McConaughey</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/05/21/esther-perel/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Esther Perel</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/05/08/elizabeth-gilbert/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Elizabeth Gilbert</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/12/20/terry-crews-how-to-have-do-and-be-all-you-want/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Terry Crews</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/08/12/sia/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Sia</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/10/27/yuval-noah-harari/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Yuval Noah Harari</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2016/06/21/malcolm-gladwell/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Malcolm Gladwell</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/05/27/secretary-madeleine-albright/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Madeleine Albright</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/03/30/cheryl-strayed/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Cheryl Strayed</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/02/18/jim-collins/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Jim Collins</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/11/11/mary-karr/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Mary Karr,</a> <a href="https://tim.blog/2014/10/21/brain-pickings/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Maria Popova</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/05/15/sam-harris-2/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Sam Harris</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/01/21/michael-phelps-grant-hackett/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Michael Phelps</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/01/16/bob-iger/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Bob Iger</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/10/31/edward-norton-motherless-brooklyn/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Edward Norton</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2015/02/02/arnold-schwarzenegger/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Arnold Schwarzenegger</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2014/06/24/neil-strauss/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Neil Strauss</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/09/12/ken-burns/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Ken Burns</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/08/26/maria-sharapova/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Maria Sharapova</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2016/05/29/marc-andreessen/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Marc Andreessen</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/03/28/neil-gaiman/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Neil Gaiman</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/10/03/neil-degrasse-tyson/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Neil de Grasse Tyson</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2016/09/21/jocko-willink-on-discipline-leadership-and-overcoming-doubt/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Jocko Willink</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/12/03/daniel-ek/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Daniel Ek</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/09/08/kelly-slater/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Kelly Slater</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/11/27/peter-attia-fasting-metformin-longevity/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Peter Attia</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2016/02/10/seth-godin/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Seth Godin</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2018/09/25/howard-marks/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Howard Marks</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/02/06/brene-brown-striving-self-acceptance-saving-marriages/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Brené Brown</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/04/09/eric-schmidt/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Eric Schmidt</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/05/01/michael-lewis/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Michael Lewis</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2018/03/08/joe-gebbia-co-founder-of-airbnb/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Joe Gebbia</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2018/05/06/michael-pollan-how-to-change-your-mind/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Michael Pollan</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/03/01/jordan-peterson/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Jordan Peterson</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/05/31/vince-vaughn/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Vince Vaughn</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/04/23/brian-koppelman/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Brian Koppelman</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/05/07/ramit-sethi/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Ramit Sethi</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/11/18/dax-shepard/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dax Shepard</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2014/10/15/money-master-the-game/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Tony Robbins</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/05/18/jim-dethmer/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Jim Dethmer</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/11/19/dan-harris/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dan Harris</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/09/13/ray-dalio/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Ray Dalio</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2015/08/18/the-evolutionary-angel-naval-ravikant/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Naval Ravikant</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/03/08/vitalik-buterin-naval-ravikant/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Vitalik Buterin</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/03/16/elizabeth-lesser/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Elizabeth Lesser</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2019/04/18/amanda-palmer-2/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Amanda Palmer</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/02/18/katie-haun/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Katie Haun</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/10/09/richard-branson/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Sir Richard Branson</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/09/02/chuck-palahniuk/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Chuck Palahniuk</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/10/18/arianna-huffington/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Arianna Huffington</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2015/08/31/the-oracle-of-silicon-valley-reid-hoffman-plus-michael-mccullough/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Reid Hoffman</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/09/17/bill-burr/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Bill Burr</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2015/06/26/whitney-cummings/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Whitney Cummings</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2015/05/15/rick-rubin/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Rick Rubin</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2020/03/26/vivek-murthy/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Vivek Murthy</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2017/09/09/darren-aronofsky/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Darren Aronofsky</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2022/02/22/margaret-atwood/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Margaret Atwood</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2022/03/24/mark-zuckerberg/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Mark Zuckerberg</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2014/09/09/peter-thiel/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Peter Thiel</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2018/02/20/gabor-mate/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Gabor Maté</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/07/09/anne-lamott/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Anne Lamott</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2022/01/12/sarah-silverman/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Sarah Silverman</a>, <a href="https://tim.blog/2021/07/06/andrew-huberman/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Dr. Andrew Huberman</a>, and many more.See Privacy Policy at <a href="https://art19.com/privacy" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://art19.com/privacy</a> and California Privacy Notice at <a href="https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info</a>.

Brought to you by Wealthfront high-yield savings account, Peloton Row premium rower for an efficient workout, and You Need A Budget cult-favorite money management app.Rick Rubin (@RickRubin) is a nine-time GRAMMY-winning producer, one of Time magazine’s 100 most influential people in the world, and the most successful producer in any genre, according to Rolling Stone. He has collaborated with artists from Tom Petty to Adele, Johnny Cash to the Red Hot Chili Peppers, Beastie Boys to Slayer, Kanye West to the Strokes, and System of a Down to Jay-Z. You can find my 2015 interview with Rick at tim.blog/RickRubin.His new book is THE CREATIVE ACT: A Way of Being. *This episode is brought to you by Wealthfront! Wealthfront is an app that helps you save and invest your money. Right now, you can earn 3.8% APY—that’s the Annual Percentage Yield—with the Wealthfront Cash Account. That’s more than fifteen times more interest than if you left your money in a savings account at the average bank, according to FDIC.gov. It takes just a few minutes to sign up, and then you’ll immediately start earning 3.8% interest on your savings. And when you open an account today, you’ll get an extra fifty-dollar bonus with a deposit of five hundred dollars or more.  Visit Wealthfront.com/Tim to get started.*This episode is also brought to you by You Need A Budget! You Need A Budget is a cult-favorite budgeting app for a reason—it works. The app and its simple 4-rule method will change the way you think about money and get you laser focused to live the life you want. With You Need A Budget, you’ll finally experience financial clarity, having all the data points you need to make informed financial decisions. With all that information at your fingertips, you can finally home in on buying that dream house, paying off that last debt, or setting yourself up to retire early. And the You Need A Budget team offers daily, free, live classes—including video courses, bootcamps, and challenges—as well as active fan groups in every corner of the internet. Try the app free for 34 days (no credit card required) at YouNeedABudget.com/Tim.*This episode is brought to you by Peloton Row! Peloton Row delivers personalized rowing workouts to help you learn and master your stroke. Form features like Form Assist and Form Ratings & Insights indicate how to improve your stroke in class in real time and provide a post-class breakdown so you can hit the Row harder next time. And with the ability to customize your target metrics, you become an expert at the level and pace that feels good for you. You get all your cardio and strength in one shot, while protecting your joints and ligaments in a high-intensity, low-impact way. Fun fact: you work 86% of your muscles in only 15 minutes.Right now is the perfect time to get rowing with Peloton Row. Peloton Row offers a variety of classes for all levels plus game-changing features that help you get rowing or advance the rowing you can already do. Explore Peloton Row at OnePeloton.com/Row.*[00:00] Start[06:28] Why Rick wrote The Creative Act.[09:24] The Tao of Rick Rubin.[12:16] Making the creative toolbox multi-purposeful.[15:00] Collaborations: ensuring the best ideas prevail over egos.[19:50] Creative revisions are experiments, not guaranteed improvements.[26:44] Knowing when to be defined by or to deviate from an established genre.[33:07] Why Rick resisted advice to make his first book an autobiography.[37:10] Even a solo project is a collaboration.[38:07] Noticing what nobody else sees.[40:24] Being in the wonderful state “which makes art inevitable.”[42:22] Craftsperson vs. artist.[44:29] Good distraction vs. bad distraction.[46:40] Breaking out of sameness.[49:24] Filtering out non-constructive feedback.[51:39] Does artificial intelligence deserve a role in the creative process?[55:36] What happens when new music catches Rick’s ear?[56:54] How to be the best music producer possible.[1:00:17] Artists who seem to best channel wonder from the mundane.[1:04:12] Managing massive inspirational intake.[1:05:24] New movies on Rick’s radar.[1:06:23] Tips for artists who want to endure the ages.[1:12:06] Pacing the book — as the writer and the reader.[1:15:39] Parting thoughts.*For show notes and past guests on The Tim Ferriss Show, please visit tim.blog/podcast.For deals from sponsors of The Tim Ferriss Show, please visit tim.blog/podcast-sponsorsSign up for Tim’s email newsletter (5-Bullet Friday) at tim.blog/friday.For transcripts of episodes, go to tim.blog/transcripts.Discover Tim’s books: tim.blog/books.Follow Tim:Twitter: twitter.com/tferriss Instagram: instagram.com/timferrissYouTube: youtube.com/timferrissFacebook: facebook.com/timferriss LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/timferrissPast guests on The Tim Ferriss Show include Jerry Seinfeld, Hugh Jackman, Dr. Jane Goodall, LeBron James, Kevin Hart, Doris Kearns Goodwin, Jamie Foxx, Matthew McConaughey, Esther Perel, Elizabeth Gilbert, Terry Crews, Sia, Yuval Noah Harari, Malcolm Gladwell, Madeleine Albright, Cheryl Strayed, Jim Collins, Mary Karr, Maria Popova, Sam Harris, Michael Phelps, Bob Iger, Edward Norton, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Neil Strauss, Ken Burns, Maria Sharapova, Marc Andreessen, Neil Gaiman, Neil de Grasse Tyson, Jocko Willink, Daniel Ek, Kelly Slater, Dr. Peter Attia, Seth Godin, Howard Marks, Dr. Brené Brown, Eric Schmidt, Michael Lewis, Joe Gebbia, Michael Pollan, Dr. Jordan Peterson, Vince Vaughn, Brian Koppelman, Ramit Sethi, Dax Shepard, Tony Robbins, Jim Dethmer, Dan Harris, Ray Dalio, Naval Ravikant, Vitalik Buterin, Elizabeth Lesser, Amanda Palmer, Katie Haun, Sir Richard Branson, Chuck Palahniuk, Arianna Huffington, Reid Hoffman, Bill Burr, Whitney Cummings, Rick Rubin, Dr. Vivek Murthy, Darren Aronofsky, Margaret Atwood, Mark Zuckerberg, Peter Thiel, Dr. Gabor Maté, Anne Lamott, Sarah Silverman, Dr. Andrew Huberman, and many more.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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#649: Rick Rubin, Legendary Producer — Timeless Methods for Unlocking Creativity, Secrets Hidden in Plain Sight, The Future with AI, Helpful Distractions, Working with Strong Personalities, Breaking Out of “The Sameness,” and More

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